Comments on: Drawing Nearer to God Through the Book of Mormon-Part 2

By: Log

Log — Sun, 09 Dec 2012 07:13:11 +0000

And I have to wonder when the Joseph Smith citations were recorded, relative to when they were uttered, and whether the comma was in the vocal presentation; that, too, makes a difference.

By: Log

Log — Sun, 09 Dec 2012 05:23:20 +0000

The phraseology “X, yea, Y” is common throughout the scripture – and Y is commonly (always?) a restatement of X. For example, at the top page, there is the following citation from the D&C: “…declare repentance and faith on the Savior, and remission of sins by baptism, and by fire, yea, even the Holy Ghost.” This is the pattern followed by Nephi in the citation at issue.

The baptism of fire is wherein we receive the gift of the Holy Ghost (even McConkie thought this beyond controversy and put it in Mormon Doctrine [see “Baptism by Fire” in Mormon Doctrine]). It matters.

By: Jared

Jared — Sun, 09 Dec 2012 01:40:47 +0000

Nthabeleng-

Thanks for coming by and leaving a comment.

My answer to your question about being stuck on the 2nd baptism is to not worry. The Lord is the one who baptizes with fire and the Holy Ghost (third baptism). When we’re ready for the third baptism we will receive it. Advancing in the gospel is accomplished step by step.

The same holds true for the 1st baptism (water) and the 2nd baptism (the Holy Ghost). The Lord extends each of these blessing when we’re ready. The day will come when each of us will be prepared for the second Comforter. Until then we need to be patient and live with faith.

Log doesn’t believe there are three baptisms. Joseph Smith said there is (Daniel Tyler statement. They Knew the Prophet, Hyrum L. Andrus, p51. Also, The Words of Joseph Smith, P. 354, Andrew F. Ehat).

In addition to what the prophet Joseph Smith taught, the Book of Mormon teaches there are three baptisms. It takes some deductive reasoning to find this doctrine being taught, but it is there.

Elder Bednar taught the following in Oct 2012 General Conference:

“Testimony is the beginning of and a prerequisite to continuing conversion. Testimony is a point of departure; it is not an ultimate destination. Strong testimony is the foundation upon which conversion is established.”

Where does testimony come from? From the Holy Ghost. Where does conversion come from? From the Holy Ghost. I believe Elder Bednar is teaching the same thing I am, but using different terms.

I think it is wonderful that you are interested in the doctrine of Christ. I wish you the best.

By: Log

Log — Sat, 08 Dec 2012 17:17:57 +0000

Because what Joseph said was “The baptism of water, without the baptism of fire and the Holy Ghost attending it, is of no use.” https://www.lds.org/manual/teachings-joseph-smith/chapter-7?lang=eng

There is not a separate, 3rd phase.

Log, I see it differently than you. That isn’t a concern. There are things that even the GA disagree on.

By: Log

Log — Sat, 08 Dec 2012 17:15:01 +0000

I believe Nephi is speaking of only two baptisms – the baptism by water, and the baptism by fire. He is explaining what is meant by receiving the Holy Ghost – it means to be baptized by fire.

By: Nthabeleng

Nthabeleng — Sat, 08 Dec 2012 03:58:44 +0000

Hi Jared

The reason I came across your blog is because I am trying to find answers as I am going through some kind of a spiritual growth. This is very interresting indeed.so does it mean that we “a lot of church members” are still stuck on the second baptism and we need to progress to the third one, of which some won’t get to experience that!!?

By: Jared

Jared — Sun, 13 May 2012 02:04:58 +0000

K-Jo

I think your thought on aligning our will with God’s is right on the mark.

By: K-Jo

K-Jo — Thu, 10 May 2012 22:22:38 +0000

Hi Jared,
I woke up the other morning and this thought was in my mind……”the reason we struggle (or wrestle) in prayer is because it is difficult to bring our will in alignment with God’s will.